Om Namah Shivaya

Om Namah Shivaya

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Showing posts with label 1930 discussion with Tagore and Einstein. Show all posts
Showing posts with label 1930 discussion with Tagore and Einstein. Show all posts

Jul 14, 2013

28th Edition Of Shadow Dancing With Mind and Celebrating 250K Hits..

Celebrating 250,000 hits and more on my blog with 390 followers with my 28th Editions of Shadow Dancing With Mind. I am grateful for the loyal friends and critics who made my blogging journey all the more worthwhile. Their thoughts and encouragement that kept me going on and on…

In this edition, you will find many interesting thoughts, stories and poetry but there is something that touched me to the core… The 10 Bomb Blasts in Bodh Gaya which shattered the peace of the most serene temples of Buddhism, the place where Buddha himself attained peace…

Anyhow, here you go with topics in this 28th Edition, if you like something, please click to read more, I am sure you will not be disappointed…

THOUGHTS THIS WEEK:
Recently I have been wondering why there are not many comments on my blog post. Started having doubts on my writing capabilities and content that I am sharing with my followers. After digging a little deeper I found that though there are not many comments but my hit rate on the posts are going up steadily. From 100 per day to 1000’s (An average of 500 per day, and recently crossed 250,000 hits), its been going upwards…  so what do you think is happening?

As early as 1912, in Transformation and Symbols of the Libido, Jung provided psychological interpretations of passages in the Upanishads and the Rig Veda.
"Indian philosophy is namely the interpretation given to the precise condition of the non-ego, which affects our personal psychology, however independent from us it remains. It sees the aim of human development as bringing about an approach to and connection between the specific nature of the non- ego and the conscious ego. Tantra yoga then gives a representation of the condition and the developmental phases of this impersonality, as it itself in its own way produces the light of a higher  supra-personal consciousness."

Bertrand Russel said once for Tagore, “I regret I cannot agree with Tagore. His talk about the infinite is vague nonsense. The sort of language that is admired by many Indians unfortunately does not, in fact, mean anything at all.” And I believe … Scientists and logicians are handicapped by the limitations of sense perception. I am happy that someone like Einstein has the humility to accept it and some like Stephen Hawking (He went on to famously proclaim, “God Does Not Exist”)feel that what they know, is absolute truth.

THE READER:
A book by Ma Anand Sheela (Sheela Ambalal Patel) Secretary of Osho (He was called Bhagwan Rajneesh by his disciples) from 1981-85, about her life and experiences with Osho, and account of, as she said in the book, “building an entire commune in Oregon and how in fit of rage, Osho destroyed it, after I resigned from his services in the year 1985.” Personally I feel that "Don't Kill Him" is about her side of the story after being accused of bio-terror etc even by OSHO himself…

An interesting story (Novella) that I recently read about life. A girl's desires and feelings, before and after marriage to a much older person so beautifully envisaged by Tolstoy. His amazing description of young girls emotions, his take on the feelings of young and then matured person in the ways of the world of Russian Social life, before and after marriage, is great and to me, looks quite truthful.Though never married, it seems Tolstoy wrote ‘Family Happiness’ – which is about marriage, to prove to himself that their marriage would not have been successful…

Testament Betrayed is a book which brings out the times that we live in and how we become what we are. A collection of essays which brings out arrays of ideas in a coherent narrative. For the writer’s its kind of challenge that Milan Kundera throws to come out of the set thought pattern and travel out of one’s comfort zone to explore spaces that sometimes are dark, filled with unknown doubts but sometimes brings out the light as at the end of tunnel. If you are a serious aspiring author, then you must read this book.

Woke up to the sounds of Bomb blast’s this Sunday morning  and looked up images from my last visit to Bodh Gaya. The images took on the shadows of darkness as the Peaceful serene atmosphere of Buddha’s place of enlightenment lay shattered…

She wanders alone
(You know any path will take you,
if you don’t know where you are going)
And moves in and out of my thoughts
Like waves upon waves
That crash on the bounded beach
Weaving a cosmic design
With her foot prints
In my heart.

Read the collaborative efforts of dozes of poets from across the world. And if you write, love collaborative writing, enthusiast of poetry and enjoy writing short verse like Haiku, Tanka, Renga, Renshi etc, then Haiku Tea sessions are for you...  Click here to join in for the Session VII (which will start from 15th July…)

Hope you will enjoy this edition... look forward to your comments and visit to the next Edition... please click on the “Join this Site” button on the right hand side top corner to follow my posts on this blog... I will be grateful.
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Shashi
नमः शिवाय
Om Namah Shivaya
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27th Edition                                                                  28th Edition

Jun 9, 2013

TALKING POINT : Einstein and Tagore on Music - 19th August 1930

“The difficulty is that the really good music, whether of the East or of the West, cannot be analyzed.” Einstein

I have had posted Nobel Laureate Rabindra Nath Tagore’s meeting with Einstein earlier where he talked about Truth, Reality and Beauty. (Click here to read it) and the talk below is his second meeting with Einstein, on 19th August, 1930. 

In the first instance, the meeting has Einstein questioning Tagore on his belief on divine and whether God is isolated from the world, to which Tagore replied, “When our universe is in harmony with man, the eternal, we know it as truth, we feel it as beauty”. Where as the second, as excerpted below, mainly centered around Modern Physics and Music.

Einstein and Tagore Curtsy Mokta Mona

“In creation we follow the central law of existence, but if we do not cut ourselves adrift from it, we can have sufficient freedom within the limits of our personality for the fullest self-expression.” Tagore

Bertrand Russel said once for Tagore, “I regret I cannot agree with Tagore. His talk about the infinite is vague nonsense. The sort of language that is admired by many Indians unfortunately does not, in fact, mean anything at all.”

And I believe that people like him, are governed by the five senses for perception and when those sense perception fails in perceiving truthfully (Like a spoon in a glass of water seems to be broken) they go around finding the reason behind it and sometimes find it (As in case of broken spoon – Laws of refractions) but if they don’t, they refuse to acknowledge it the truth (That the spoon is actually not broken) till the time another person comes with another set of laws.

Scientists and logicians are handicapped by the limitations of sense perception. I am happy that someone like Einstein has the humility to accept it and some like Stephen Hawking (He went on to famously proclaim, “God Does Not Exist” click here to read… )feel that what they know, is absolute truth.

Divine is nothing but collective consciousness of the Universe, including mine. To know that Universal consciousness, one has to go within to up-link  that’s what I believe in, whether it means anything to people like Bertrand Russel, Stephen Hawking etc. or not.

Anyways, here is the part of the talk curtsy Mukto Mona… on Music.  To read the full talk, please click here…

EINSTEIN AND TAGORE ON MODERN PHYSICS, MUSIC ETC.
Excerpted from "Three conversations: Tagore Talks with Einstein, with Rolland, and Wells"  (ASIA 3/1931, p.139-143,196 f.)
Einstein and Tagore Curtsy Ms. Sabina Choudhary

EINSTEIN: I believe that whatever we do or live for has its causality; it is good, however, that we cannot see through to it.

TAGORE: There is in human affairs an element of elasticity also, some freedom within a small range which is for the expression of our personality. It is like the musical system in India, which is not so rigidly fixed as western music. Our composers give a certain definite outline, a system of melody and rhythmic arrangement, and within a certain limit the player can improvise upon it. He must be one with the law of that particular melody, and then he can give spontaneous expression to his musical feeling within the prescribed regulation. We praise the composer for his genius in creating a foundation along with a superstructure of melodies, but we expect from the player his own skill in the creation of variations of melodic flourish and ornamentation. In creation we follow the central law of existence, but if we do not cut ourselves adrift from it, we can have sufficient freedom within the limits of our personality for the fullest self-expression.

EINSTEIN: It requires a very high standard of art to realize fully the great idea in the original music, so that one can make variations upon it. In our country, the variations are often prescribed.

TAGORE: If in our conduct we can follow the law of goodness, we can have real liberty of self-expression. The principle of conduct is there, but the character which makes it true and individual is our own creation. In our music there is a duality of freedom and prescribed order.

EINSTEIN: Are the words of a song also free? I mean to say, is the singer at liberty to add his own words to the song which he is singing?

TAGORE: Yes. In Bengal we have a kind of song-kirtan, we call it-which gives freedom to the singer to introduce parenthetical comments, phrases not in the original song. This occasions great enthusiasm, since the audience is constantly thrilled by some beautiful, spontaneous sentiment added by the singer.
EINSTEIN: Can the Indian music be sung without words? Can one understand a song without words?

TAGORE: Yes, we have songs with unmeaning words, sounds which just help to act as carriers of the notes. In North India, music is an independent art, not the interpretation of words and thoughts, as in Bengal. The music is very intricate and subtle and is a complete world of melody by itself.

TAGORE: Melody and harmony are like lines and colors in pictures. A simple linear picture may be completely beautiful; the introduction of color may make it vague and insignificant. Yet color may, by combination with lines, create great pictures, so long as it does not smother and destroy their value. 

EINSTEIN: It is a beautiful comparison; line is also much older than color. It seems that your melody is much richer in structure than ours. Japanese music also seems to be so.

EINSTEIN: The difficulty is that the really good music, whether of the East or of the West, cannot be analyzed.

TAGORE: Yes, and what deeply affects the hearer is beyond himself.

EINSTEIN: The same uncertainty will always be there about everything fundamental in our experience, in our reaction to art, whether in Europe or in Asia. Even the red flower I see before me on your table may not be the same to you and me.

TAGORE: And yet there is always going on the process of reconciliation between them, the individual taste conforming to the universal standard.

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Shashi
ॐ नमः शिवाय
Om Namah Shivaya

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